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Mad Dog View Drop Down
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    Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 14:14
Hi all
It's been a while since I last posted on here.
My question is,..... Does anyone have a recommendation for a replacement stator. I can't afford the upgrade/downgrade as some fcktard reversed into my MV and left without leaving any details and it's costing a mint.
The bike is an rsvr 04 gen2.
Many thanks in advance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Duggers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 14:27
Sorry to hear of your misfortunes. I don't think anyone would recommend you simply replace the stator without any modification. I bought an Electrosport but I also installed the t10 oil spray and Compufire linear regulator relocated under the rear right cowl with Delphi 630 beefy connector, soldered. All in was less than 500 quid.  Unfortunately I don't think it makes much difference which stator you install, they will all burn out unless you do something to cool, or fit the updated rotor. Ian
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 15:43
I might be totally out of order here as electrics are a kind of black art to me,but given that the problem is excessive magnetic flux and no amount of thicker windings,Cumpufire regs or spraying some hot waste oil the general direction will make the problem go away it seems there is are only two possibilities left.

The first and only proven option being the later complete 370W electrics upgrade with a de rated rotor OR

has anyone ever tried grinding the magnetic rotor to increase the air gap?  On a theoretical level would that decrease the magnetic field?

If so on a practical level I'm sure 1/2hr on a cylinder grinder would do the job,I know increasing the air gap on Hall sensors has a marked effect on how they work

It just occurred to me to wonder if everyone has blinkers on or possibly there is another,cheaper way out of the problem
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Duggers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 15:54
I did very extensive research on this issue and on one of the other forums there was work done to show the heat reduction with a. A linear regulator and b. With oil filling the stator (given that they fail at the top where there is no oil cooling them). The difference is significant. Even got oil is much for than having the windings in fresh air at greater than 250C with the heat generated by a shunt rectifier shorted to ground once the battery is charged. Do the research and you'll find out. Ian
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 16:13
I have read all about it on AF1 and the claims people made

Every other manufacturer with the same issues made the suppliers de rate the rotor,Aprilia didn't for whatever reason and continued fitting proven unreliable components probably hoping the problem didn't arise until the warranty expired.

That's the story,end of,if you don't replace the affected components then at best you're putting a band aid on a cut that needs stitching and hoping it holds.

I was merely wondering out loud if there was a simple,cheap,once and for all alternative to the only proven remedy.

Pissing on a brush fire is not the best remedy LOL
www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
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www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Duggers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 16:47
Sorry I should have been clearer, work interrupted :)

The solution I proposed is a mitigation rather than a cure, but there have been instances of the 370W updated setup failing too, and that's I believe because the problem is manifold.

1. The stator/generator combination generates excessive heat with a shunt reg which shorts the circuit when the battery is at full charge. Compounded by:
2. The top of the stator where it fails is in fresh air and not cooled by oil as most other bikes are, probably exacerebated by the RSV having a dry sump. Its also informative I think that the RSV4 has an oil spray aimed at the top of the stator. Why would Aprilia go to the cost of that if it were useless? Clearly they learned lessons from their earlier f-ups with the RSV, probably aided by the people on these forums that did great work finding a workable solution in those early days when Aprilia were nowhere.

Given the above, the only true solution would be to fit the 370W kit AND a linear reg AND oil spray, however that would be approaching 1500 quid and who is going to pay that for a 13 year old bike? I chose a path that is well worn and people have had considerable success with, often going years (I know of a case of 8 years having had multiple failures with the original design) selling the bike with stator still in good shape.

In my case I wanted to move the reg away from the engine anyway, and place it on its own circuit with its own fuse, and locate it closer to the battery. The rear cowl was ideal there being a vent there already, holes in the frame already that were almost exactly right for the Compu-Fire and I could fit it all in, but I chose to file a bit off the corners of the fins to give extra clearance.

Since I fitted it I've not done enough miles to say personally whether it's a long term solution, but I can see that the new oil I added when I changed the reg is still straw coloured, with no discolouration whatsover, meaning that the stator hasn't burned. Others reported seeing black oil after a few hundred miles with simple stator replacement.

For more information and *extensive* research, see http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/showthread.php?272680-Stator-failures-Oil-Mod-and-Series-Regulator/page2 and in particualr the posts by micbrugo. (Translated from the original Italian at https://www.apriliagarage.it/forum/viewtopic.php?f=163&t=46853.

There is another post by a German chap who took heat maps before linear reg / after linear reg / linear and oil spray and showed without a shadow of a doubt that with both the exterior of the cover was a good 30C cooler. I grant you that doesn't mean that the internal is scientifically proven to be cooler, but I am pragmatic enough to take it as being so. Unfortunately I can't lay hands on that post at the minute, but if anyone else can, please could you add it to this thread. Ian
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cwp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 18:03
I'm on my 3rd or 4th one in 10 yrs. Griff put me onto a updated one which had to be done through a dealer 2 yrs ago I think. All I can advise is to talk to him. 
born ugly what's your excuse!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote constant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 18:29
theres a link on af1 t12 tech sell an oil spray gadget that you connect to the oil tank pipe and then screw into the stator casing an it srays oil onto it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2018 at 18:34
Originally posted by Duggers Duggers wrote:

Sorry I should have been clearer, work interrupted :)

The solution I proposed is a mitigation rather than a cure, but there have been instances of the 370W updated setup failing too, and that's I believe because the problem is manifold.

1. The stator/generator combination generates excessive heat with a shunt reg which shorts the circuit when the battery is at full charge. Compounded by:
2. The top of the stator where it fails is in fresh air and not cooled by oil as most other bikes are, probably exacerebated by the RSV having a dry sump. Its also informative I think that the RSV4 has an oil spray aimed at the top of the stator. Why would Aprilia go to the cost of that if it were useless? Clearly they learned lessons from their earlier f-ups with the RSV, probably aided by the people on these forums that did great work finding a workable solution in those early days when Aprilia were nowhere.

Given the above, the only true solution would be to fit the 370W kit AND a linear reg AND oil spray, however that would be approaching 1500 quid and who is going to pay that for a 13 year old bike? I chose a path that is well worn and people have had considerable success with, often going years (I know of a case of 8 years having had multiple failures with the original design) selling the bike with stator still in good shape.

In my case I wanted to move the reg away from the engine anyway, and place it on its own circuit with its own fuse, and locate it closer to the battery. The rear cowl was ideal there being a vent there already, holes in the frame already that were almost exactly right for the Compu-Fire and I could fit it all in, but I chose to file a bit off the corners of the fins to give extra clearance.

Since I fitted it I've not done enough miles to say personally whether it's a long term solution, but I can see that the new oil I added when I changed the reg is still straw coloured, with no discolouration whatsover, meaning that the stator hasn't burned. Others reported seeing black oil after a few hundred miles with simple stator replacement.

For more information and *extensive* research, see http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/showthread.php?272680-Stator-failures-Oil-Mod-and-Series-Regulator/page2 and in particualr the posts by micbrugo. (Translated from the original Italian at https://www.apriliagarage.it/forum/viewtopic.php?f=163&t=46853.

There is another post by a German chap who took heat maps before linear reg / after linear reg / linear and oil spray and showed without a shadow of a doubt that with both the exterior of the cover was a good 30C cooler. I grant you that doesn't mean that the internal is scientifically proven to be cooler, but I am pragmatic enough to take it as being so. Unfortunately I can't lay hands on that post at the minute, but if anyone else can, please could you add it to this thread. Ian


And all the above is exactly why I wondered whether a quick skim over the magnets to increase the air gap and decrease the flux would be THE  cheap,magic bullet.

You don't hear of Gen1's having these issues and also post 2007/8 ( models not reg's) seem to be pretty immune so you can really discount the oil jet being necessary.

The V4's are a different animal entirely,smaller,more powerful,much higher revving consequently putting out more heat Wink
www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mad Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Aug 2018 at 12:45
Thanks for all the info. I have already fitted the t12 cooler mod and have tried 3 different reg/rec including the latest series one from the Suzuki tl100 which cost me over £200 and failed within an afternoon.
I am now looking into having my rotor demagnetised and then re magnetised. This is going to be a bit hit or miss because of the lack of info on how much magnetic field should be reintroduced to the rotor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CarsOrBikes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 16:38
I used one from Electrex World. It came with a longer loom to bypass the central brown connector which is useful and created more room in the V plus allowed a slightly longer run, plus a new brown housing and terminals for the regulator end which I used rather than delete the connector for no reason as some do.
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