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Perspective owner advice required

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budd View Drop Down
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    Posted: 21 Dec 2019 at 14:45
OK I have a '01 RSV R but I've have a bit of an issue with it, basically it's not fast enough a lot of my mates have bought new bikes this year and I'm finding the old Mille is now struggling. And I'm not talking new super bikes here but naked and adventure bikes, the Ape can hold it's own in the twisties but any sniff of a decent length straight and we have a problem, bikes like the BMW XR 1000, KTM 1290, Triumph Speed Triple simply have to much muscle unfortunately the old girl is finally showing her age. Even the new GS is bloody fast I was genuinely surprised how fast they are, the ape comfortably had the legs on the outgoing GS 1200 but the new 1250 with it's shift cam engine is a completely different beast, I now really struggle to pass one in a straight line, couple this to electronic suspension, very effective rider aids and a commanding riding position the Mille as it's work cut out on fast A roads and no chance down an bumpy back road. An as I said these aren't new super bikes but essentially big tourers, the rider just sits there with his heated seats/grips nice big screen plenty of room floating over pot holes and the like, by contrast life on the Aprilia is not so pleasant, I'm having to ride the wheels off it just to keep up, combine this with choppy suspension, extreme riding position I'm now thinking it's time for a change. Now I love the ape to bits and I'll be keeping it for track days, but the reality is I'm getting to old to be riding it all day, after a full day in the saddle I'm really suffering. So the plan is to buy another bike, I don't want to go down the full adventure bike route and owning an Aprilia as been a joy so the natural replacement bike would seem to be a Tuono V4, more power, less extreme riding position and a full electronics package.
So before I go shopping I thought I'd familiarise myself with the various incarnations of the Tuono.
I assume that the basic advice would be to buy the newest I can afford, but what else do I need to now? how do the various models and spec levels relate to each other? what are the real life differences between say a early 2011 to a 2015/16 and that to a 18/19 model? Prices start at around £5K for a 11/12and I've found a nice looking 2015 V4 factory (ohlins, OZ s etc) 15K mls full Aprilia S/H @ £7700 from a dealer, this seems decent value but then there are brand new pre reg bikes @ £10999, 
this bike I likely to be the last bike I buy so I need to make the right choice, is there anything else I should know??
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Ice-mille View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ice-mille Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2019 at 14:51
1060 kit, and its the twisties that show true Grit. Not the straights.
Last year i drove Gsx1400 a big oil tanker, always my mates would leave me on the straights, hayabusas. But in the twisties i spanked their asses. On a retro bike. 
Keep your girl, upgrade or buy gen2, and tune. Nothing beats a v-twin roaring..... my 2cents

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budd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote budd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2019 at 15:07
I can't argue with any of that, but like I said I'll be keeping the Mille ( it's the one featured in the Superleggera build thread in the RSV section) it's already quite well modified and is still a very capable bike and one I still enjoy riding. It's just I'm not getting any younger (going on 60...) and I can still ride flat out but only for a small time 15/20 mins track day sessions with a rest in between are about my limit now, but full day in the saddle riding, lets just say 'pressing on a bit'  I'm both physically and mentally done in, while my mates on the newer bikes are refreshed and relaxed after a say a 250 mile ride out, simply because the bike are easier and less extreme to ride, effectively giving more performance with less effort, that sounds like something I could get used to...  
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426hemi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 426hemi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2019 at 15:09
Had an earlier tuono racing and they are lovely but as a nearly naked bike it was a pain once over 120, got it up to 150 once and it was dangerous as you had to hold on so tight you couldn’t steer the bike and I don’t think my neck has ever fully recovered. I sold it back to Griff not long after, also have a 1200s multistrada and that’s a pretty much do it all bike and can embarrass a lot of superbike riders.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote budd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2019 at 15:27
I quite rarely exceed 150 anymore, my mille tops out about 157 on it's current gearing so ultimate top end isn't a priority, add to this the risk from a tug from the old bill and top speed runs are even more risky. A mate of mine earlier this yr was caught at 137 in a national speed limit, he got a 12 month ban £800 fine and 6 points on his licence when he eventually gets it back,and the magistrate was talking about a custodial sentence so given the nature of new super bikes getting locked up for a moments 'fun' is a very real possibility. I think the multi strada much like the BMW XR is a do it all solution, a sports bike, tourer all in one and unlike similar machines of yesteryear you don't lose out in any department they are not compromised anymore. I don't do much touring so large luggage capability isn't a concern I can generally get all the kit I need in a tank bag, and the lack of wind protection may be a blessing in regard of keeping speeds reasonable, so the Tuono ticks all the boxes and is still top of my list. 
  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Spoonz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Dec 2019 at 16:27
I have a Gs1200 and an rsv. I ride the Gs 95% of the time as it is as fast as the rsv in most road scenarios and faster in some but with the added comfort, range etc etc. 

But I guess it depends what type of riding you do. If you tour etc a v4 tuono is far from ideal but as a ride out bike it’s range etc isn’t an issue. Having said all of that if you get a very good rider on any bike they can embarrass you regardless of what your on. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote budd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2019 at 12:33
That's my point it's so easy to access the performance of something like a GS, and the XR is pretty much the equal of all but the very latest super bikes. But I can't afford a new GS, XR or multi strada and it's the most recent ones that really provide the cutting edge performance and even used they hold their value reasonably well. Unlike the Tuono which deprecates rapidly and therefore make them excellent value.
I may do a complete U turn on this because I was having a think about it last night and may have another option.    
I also have an old ('91)CBR1000f that I use if I need to cover distances and also take my lad out on (the RSV is a single seat) but while it has a belting engine the cycle parts are pure 80s, the brakes especially are bordering on dangerous. But I quite like the big Honda and if were slightly more modern then it would be difficult to fault, so with this in mind I could sell my 1000f, return the Mille to stock, sell all the tuning bits on bobs separately add this to the money money I have put aside this should give me around £8-9K. Not enough to fund a new bike without finance and I don't want to borrow money, so this would buy me a 15/16 plate 1100 factory which on the face off it sounds perfect but I could also split the money and invest in 2 bikes...
Because I quite like the Honda a Super Blackbird would make a perfect replacement for the elderly CBR1000F, £2K buys a lot of Honda usually with fitted luggage, this would be perfect for taking the youngster out and any touring I might decide to do I may even be able get the missus on the back, although this may cause marital discourse and may be better avoided. So that brings me to the second bike option, I could buy a slightly older Tuono V4 but I could also buy a KTM RC8. I've always really fancied the big KTM, I respect KTMs bravery for actually making the thing and even find it weirdly attractive. It's a controversial choice I know but I think now I probably the time to buy one, they are such a mermite bike that prices vary wildly and it's possible to pick up a really clean late model R version for not a lot of money and I'd expect they will start going up in value. Mind you I've been saying that about the Mille for sometime and their values are hardly soaring, although I'm sure they will start to at some point...   
So maybe having a big dependable mile-muncher along side something that's half motorcycle half stealth fighter would be a viable option, it would certainly be interesting..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ice-mille Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2019 at 13:01
Mile muncher, and tourqe monster.... i would recommend Gsx1400. 
Like driving a Cadillac. 126nm original. I owned one, could just drive for days, and it can go forever, one guy in sweden has over 300.000kms.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 426hemi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2019 at 13:03
My friend has an rc8 with a load of tuning bits on and they are a great bike and very comfortable with a lot of adjustment, if you buy one don’t damage the mirrors as they are £207 each and unobtanium second hand as my friend found out, other parts are readily available for the right money though.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidrsurfer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2019 at 13:18
Great bike it was but I didn't keep my 2011 Tuono v4 long. There were things about it that irritated me. Cream seat went pink, lots of mechanical noise from the engine especially the gearbox, lazy camchain tensioner, chrome dropped off the headlight reflectors & it never really felt special like my old gen2 factory or my current rc8r does. Having said that I am very tempted by a superduke r, there a number of pre registered ones in dealers now for £11k! That's a steal. If you are set on a v4 I would be looking for the latest 1100 Factory with a FULL service history & no track scars!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Spoonz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2019 at 15:24
2020 super duke r essentially has an rc8 frame Dave to improve its handling so should feel familiar.   But you will need to wait till late 2020 when they discount those. 

My only criticism of Ktm is that the heavy end of year discounts depreciates used prices meaning if you paid rrp you take a big hit after the first year should you not keep it long. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote budd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2019 at 15:33
the more I think about it the more I'm liking the Honda / KTM combination the best of both worlds you might say. I nearly bought an RC8 about 3 years ago but at the time couldn't afford the more desirable 'R' version so I sort of talked myself out of it, it was the sensible thing to do at the time but part of me always regretted it, so now maybe it's the time to scratch the KTM itch. As for the Super Blackbird they are just a monster of a bike, Honda build quality, usually mature owners so unlikely to have been abused to much and there's plenty about at good money, tatty ones with big miles can be had around £1500 but a real nice clean example is around £2K. I know there are lots cable bikes around the GSX1400 is a good bike but I don't think they have the all round ability the Blackbirds have, certainly not the top speed, but not much does!

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