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Tifa View Drop Down
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    Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 19:05
Just got back in from a bit of a rip.
I can report that there are now newly installed average speed cameras on the back road Llangollen/Corwen....the Pentrefoelas road between the Pondo and Corwen.
One of my favourite stretches of racetrack road too 
Oh well......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redratbike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 19:20
bugger 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cwp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 19:32
Ffs hope it's not the tip of the iceberg.  Nice road that from Llangollen to Corwen 
born ugly what's your excuse!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidrsurfer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 20:56
On a similar note. Read on my RoSPA group about the smart motorways. Apparently the anpr & speed cameras work 24/7 & "some chief constable" use them to enforce 70mph limits. Matter of time before they all do.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tifa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 20:58
Originally posted by cwp cwp wrote:

Ffs hope it's not the tip of the iceberg.  Nice road that from Llangollen to Corwen 

I've got a sneaky suspicion that it might be.
5 years ago, the cost of installing average speed cameras was £1.5m per mile. These days, it's now less than £100k. 
So in the long run, it's fully automated and more cost effective than the mobile scamera vans.
The new units are clever to be fair. 
There's an infra red array next to them, so that can snap away 24/7 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Spoonz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 21:01
What is the speed limit on that road out of interest. Is it a 60 zone or restricted ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tifa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 21:25
Was a 60, and reduced to 50 last year.
It's awful now...almost boring....mind you, in it's defence,  I actually spotted a cow today LOL usually, I'm bailing along that fast, don't see anything ...Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Johnboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Apr 2018 at 11:27
had me worried for a moment then! We went out Sunday, and came from Betws y coed to the corwen lights, but went straight on to Llangollen. Saying that, Adzed went left at the lights, towards the Pondy.
I'll have to ask him about the cameras... 

Thanks for the heads up.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CarsOrBikes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 00:34
I've only seen a couple of new yellow cameras at Llandegla at the start and finish of the moor road but no signs whatsoever. They'll no doubt do the Evo Triangle, there are other roads better than those though.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 09:29
Damn things are starting to creep in now,there are new ones installed on the westbound A55 taking in Rhuallt hill which are going live any day now,and in spite of big temporary warning signs they are still almost invisible as they blend in with the scenery.

As they get more affordable I can see them popping up like mushrooms on a lot of popular biking roads as they would pay for themselves almost immediately and then they could just sit back and watch the profits roll inCry

Having said that though I agree something has to be done about the wannabee racers infesting the countryside on sunny weekends,bloody scary seeing some of the riding ( and driving) on display.

The Brenig leg of the Evo triangle has already lost a lot of it's appeal due to the logging opening up the views and I can easily see that being completely neutered by whatever means possible now the boy racers in cars treat it like their private race track.

If Evo hadn't have discovered it the moors would probably have stayed a biking paradise where we could play quietly by ourselves within reason
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blacklines Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 09:44
To be honest the roads are quickly losing their fun for me. Particularly now I've been on track.

Even taking it easy as a novice rider it can be frustrating to get stuck behind a GTI or 911 who thinks he's a race driver swerving across the road making overtakes more risky than they need to be. Or bundles of cars bunched up so much you either have to pull over and let space build or wait for an opportunity to overtake a dozen at once.

I've always been sensible on the roads but, even without speed cameras, it is other road users that are starting to ruin it for me. Not even from a safety perspective. Just from a 'fuuuuuck! nice set of bends but I'm stuck behind some c**t in an M3' perspective.

Just need to convince the wife to move to Louth.. Or maybe the chap in the M3 would be less annoying if I were more competent at overtaking.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 09:57
Nope,you're right.   The roads are for transport. end of!

The track is for having fun in a safe (er) environment.  At least everyone is going the same way and there are usually some sort of run off/cushion at likely crash points.

Unfortunately one has to plan track days in advance and the costs are starting to escalate.

I usually treat them as a place to ride as fast as I feel comfortable with,some others seem to want to use them as a measure of their virility LOL


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Spoonz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 10:45
That's the beauty of touring to somewhere like the Pyrenees. Once there and on the twisties your average speed is probably 40mph as the corners are tight and frequent. You can have loads of fun and never get out of 3rd gear for miles.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 10:56
There is usually less traffic as well which helps,some of the roads I've been on in France down into Spain would put modern racetracks to shame.

I think as you get older the pleasure in trying to ride smoothly and efficiently gives more of a buzz than speed for speeds sake.

One advantage of some of the roads I amuse myself on here in N Wales,if you can ride at the posted limits constantly then at my average level of skill you would be riding with no safety cushion at all.

I've finally reached that age when I think more about what's just round that corner
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rsvwalt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 11:00
my biggest gripe is folks that dont indicate, especially at roundabouts, it seems to becoming an epidemic.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 11:11
Ah,the Doris Stokes school of motoring LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote snowman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 12:01
indicating is only curtesy not law , it pisses me to on roundabouts ,must admit I don’t Use mine much on my bike for fear of leaving them on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stevex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 12:54
Originally posted by Spoonz Spoonz wrote:

That's the beauty of touring to somewhere like the Pyrenees. Once there and on the twisties your average speed is probably 40mph as the corners are tight and frequent. You can have loads of fun and never get out of 3rd gear for miles.

Yep, the Spanish side's roads are perfect, and devoid of traffic most of the time. 
I'm off there again this summer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CarsOrBikes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 13:10
Ramble incoming.........
Actually after the Brenig road I prefer the right turn to Denbigh of the moor road, apart from the slightly off camber very shiny worn right just before the newly posted 30 where the weak barrier is, the road is nice. The left turn onto the Evo leg is a road I've never felt I get used to, a couple of bits are nice and the middle of nowhere feeling is lovely, yet the road is lacking so far for me on my bike.
I'm not exactly slow, but I'm far from the crew that leave at 6am to get their speed done before North Wales wakes up, I've been out with a couple of lads I used to work with and it was simply way too hard trying to keep with them, and the speed was just 'all out' as soon as they got to a straight and on the Brenig leg I'll never forget pulling 140 at one point which I'm amazed I even managed, as riding on my own I might be around 90, and on the straights have no real desire to work the bike up to higher speeds just because it'll do it, I like to at least have a sense of the views.
 
If I take the right after the Brenig leg, there is a little village where there is a left to Llansannan? A pal showed me that road which I have got a little more used to, and it's one of the nice technical roads, and of course the road from Abergele to Llanrwst which is always pretty good because it goes on for a while, and the Crimean Pass of course. Ffestiniog moor from Llan Ffestiniog to the A4212 is great and I hope gets left alone, but again apart from a few places I probably don't go that quick, my rides I always think I'm going fast until someone quick makes me look like I'm in reverse haha.
 
The cars in organised runs really piss me off sometimes to be fair, they have no idea about bikes, and other drivers out for a hoon, they don't understand we can't adopt a different line in a way they can when we're committed. Then the general traffic that has no gap to pull into as they're all in each others boot lids for why? Then the fools that want to race a bike, what the f**k's that all about? It's all very well trying to impress the girlfriend, but she wouldn't be impressed if later part of a tragedy. 
 
On Denbigh Moor a few bikers have been collected by these people out in runs chavs or petrol heads both, trying to get past each other when they haven't the room in their sometimes underpowered cars. Even if they have a bit of power, when they pull out at 70 they perhaps don't realise how much ground they need to clear another car when on these roads. Different if done from way back which is when you can flick past, but in convoy with no gap and same speeds, it's all the need to accelerate when on the wrong side of the road already, idiots.
 
I hold my hand up and will say I do it in my car too, but I drop back before my potential passing point, build the speed I'm prepared to scrub if I need to, and get it done quicker than all of them, but to be fair, that has been altered and has much shorter gearing than most and a 100hp over it's original with much bigger brakes. It will do a few cars in one go, but then I probably look a lot further down the road too compared to some. I think a lot of bikers do too but not all, some are clearly not confident in passing, or traffic which is a shame. I always hang on to give them the chance to get their move in when out on my bike, but watching them is sometimes painful, missing the moment and going late, or hanging on to the rear light of the car they want to pass for ages, probably looking down instead of up, jerky movements and ham fisted throttle but we're all different, and maybe their caution is a good thing but I wish they'd drop back and use their mirrors. It's hard sometimes to pass bikers that don't.
 
I expect these camera's will increase, they wanted some years ago to tax us all based on road usage remember? I wonder if what they're doing is part of that rearing it's ugly head again. That whole idea was terrible, people like us that live out of cities, and the increasing need to travel further for work isn't our fault, and we'd get taxed unfairly for it, we already earn less due to the tax on fuel we have to use more of, and trains or bus is just out of the question so we pay and pay and pay. Now they have an easy way of making more money, I know in the name of safety fundamentally, but it isn't just about speed, it's the way folk drive/ride too, so imo Policing is better than just a camera.
 
I dare say the Ponderosa will lose some of it's customers, the ratio of sports bikes vs Harley's will change haha. There are so many great roads, but if this tech infects them all I'll be using my Stelvio more, because the sports bikes need a bit of freedom. That said these are average speed, and as someone said the other day, they were certain on the Corwen road the cameras are average speed in 50% of each direction not both ways over the whole road? Is that right?
 
My biggest issue with all these now nannied roads is the people that don't get to the speed limit. I know they're a maximum, but they're so doctored now they should be regarded as a target speed, and the reason I expect most end up going so much quicker is often due to having to pass those refusing to get to the posted speed, hence the illusion of ignorance of recklessness, trying to get past quickly. Funny how nobody challenges dawdlers! They deserve some responsibility for others actions haha.
 
;O)
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mr Miller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 13:18
Originally posted by rsvwalt rsvwalt wrote:

my biggest gripe is folks that dont indicate, especially at roundabouts, it seems to becoming an epidemic.

To be fair it`s no easy to indicate while checking yer texts an
yer hair doo ..
If you find us in a hedge check the bike first please .. I`m free on the NHS...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 14:15
Originally posted by CarsOrBikes CarsOrBikes wrote:

Ramble incoming.........
Actually after the Brenig road I prefer the right turn to Denbigh of the moor road, apart from the slightly off camber very shiny worn right just before the newly posted 30 where the weak barrier is, the road is nice.

Same,I've never felt really happy on the leg to Pentrefoelas either

 
Originally posted by CarsOrBikes CarsOrBikes wrote:

If I take the right after the Brenig leg, there is a little village where there is a left to Llansannan? A pal showed me that road which I have got a little more used to, and it's one of the nice technical roads, and of course the road from Abergele to Llanrwst which is always pretty good because it goes on for a while

That would be Bylchau,nice church on the r/h side opposite the junction,that's also on my most favoured roads list. That's one of the places that I was thinking of when I said that being on the posted limits all the time was not comfortable

Originally posted by CarsOrBikes CarsOrBikes wrote:


I dare say the Ponderosa will lose some of it's customers, the ratio of sports bikes vs Harley's will change haha.


Already quite a Hardly gathering place,I must admit I tend to only use the place as a turning point these days. My favoured run generally is Abergele/Llanfair TH/Llanssanan/Bylchau/Brennig/Cerrig/Ruthin/Pondy and back again.  Best done early afternoon during the week when one has the road almost to oneself.

Cerrig to part way to Llanwrst here with no sound
 



 
Originally posted by CarsOrBikes CarsOrBikes wrote:

My biggest issue with all these now nannied roads is the people that don't get to the speed limit. I know they're a maximum, but they're so doctored now they should be regarded as a target speed, Funny how nobody challenges dawdlers! They deserve some responsibility for others actions haha.
 


I mostly agree with you but for some people on roads like from Bylchau onwards on my vid above that is too fast,especially if you don't have local knowledge. Maintaining 60 around those roads can be as stressful as much higher speeds around somewhere like Cadwell given the amount of tourists/farmers/ and sunday drivers likely to be found just round the next corner. 

Remember also there are many other local hazards from time to time like farmers dragging mud and slurry from field to field and even local flooding after heavy rains due to run off from the fields to contend with.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blacklines Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 14:57
Originally posted by CarsOrBikes CarsOrBikes wrote:

My biggest issue with all these now nannied roads is the people that don't get to the speed limit. I know they're a maximum, but they're so doctored now they should be regarded as a target speed, and the reason I expect most end up going so much quicker is often due to having to pass those refusing to get to the posted speed, hence the illusion of ignorance of recklessness, trying to get past quickly. Funny how nobody challenges dawdlers! They deserve some responsibility for others actions haha.


Yeah there's a lot of people on the roads with very low confidence driving out of town. The 45 mph brigade. Won't go above 45 on an open NSL road and don't slow down from it in a town or residential area.

If they don't have the driving ability to drive a modern car near the national limit on an open 60 limit road that is easy to do it, why do they think they can then exceed the limit by 50%? The main difference is on a NSL road they are more likely to harm themselves, in a town they are more likely to harm someone's child/nana/dog. Completely selfish.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote legend88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 15:25
Originally posted by blacklines blacklines wrote:

If they don't have the driving ability to drive a modern car near the national limit on an open 60 limit road that is easy to do it, why do they think they can then exceed the limit by 50%?


You would be surprised how many don't even know that speed limits vary! Believe it or not, when I was on a speed awareness course a few years ago from a group of about 30 people about eight genuinely believed that there was a single speed limit for all roads in the UK! Quite what they think all the signs are about I don't know.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 15:39
They probably don't even notice the signs Shocked

I have a mate who whenever he drives (or especially rides) seems to just go at his maximum comfort speed regardless of any posted limits,it's as if he has blinkers on and can only see what's directly in front of him.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blacklines Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 16:26
Originally posted by legend88 legend88 wrote:

from a group of about 30 people about eight genuinely believed that there was a single speed limit for all roads in the UK! Quite what they think all the signs are about I don't know.


That is actually pretty shocking. You reckon all 8 stood corrected afterwards?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ice-mille Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2018 at 19:13
Sorry this made me laugh😂
Did not know one could be that lost in space



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Hahahaaaa.............they walk among us.....
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