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JMH's 1060 Big Bore project

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JMH View Drop Down
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    Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 09:00

Time to start this thread. Below a cunning plan plus acquired items and to be acquired items:

Plan:

Gen1 engine with Griff’s 1060 kit + Gen2 heads & Gen2 TBs + Edwards airbox with OEM paper filter. JS Performance hoses. The cherry on the cake is TSS slipper clutch. By the way, has anyone got one for sale?

The engine is a 70 tkm Gen1 engine from 2002 Mille. It will be taken apart and checked for wear and tear. For this reason I ask if anyone has good condition Gen1 engine spares in case I need them. I guess it is mainly gearbox related but con rod bearings and such can come to question.

Once the heads and barrels are out the barrels will be shipped to Apriliaperformance and the disassembling of the lower end continues. Hopefully all is good there so that the engine, equipped with TSS slipper clutch now, is ready for the new 1060 barrels and pistons once they come.

After that the tinkering to mate the Gen2 heads to the engine continues. Hopefully the engine is in the frame in January/ February so that that the TB can be mounted and there was a way to use the original idle tuning with the Gen2 TB.

March time could be starting the engine and getting it to a dyno room for 1-2 hours.

Acquired:

Gen 2 Heads
Gen 2 TB
57 mm intake funnels
Gen 2 downpipes
Edwards airbox lower half
Adapters to the jets
PCIII
566,8 €

 

 

To be acquired:

Gabro chip

TSS Clutch

Gasket kit (Athena)

JS Performance hoses anc clips

1060 Big Bore kit with head gaskets and pistons

Questions will be asked and if you have parts related to this project for sale, please offer them to me in an affordable manner Big smile

 

Finally, the goal would be to have 140 hp on the rear wheel. How hard could it be?

Mille Aarrr -02
My riding lines are like Hendrix's solos. Unexpected and always different.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redratbike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 10:48
The idle adjust / cold start mech swaps over from gen1 to gen2 throttle bodies

Fit gen2 conrods they are stronger

Are you going slotted cam sprockets ? 106/109?

Smaltmoto have tss for 629 euros


www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 11:06
Timing will be checked before the decision to slot the cams. Kämna Ducati has also TSS at roughly the same price.

I will stick to Gen1 rods as the change to Gen2 would apparently include some hassle with lubrication of the big end. Additionally the Gen1 rods seem to be good for 200+ hp as the local Gen1 Turbuono has showed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redratbike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 12:37
Originally posted by JMH JMH wrote:

the local Gen1 Turbuono has showed.
think I have a photo of that somewhere does have a big turbo hanging out the side??


Edit...found it



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 12:50
That is it.
Mille Aarrr -02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote snowman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 16:42
Not a very nice looking bike IMO ????
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Af1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 17:08

Ideal bike if you only have one leg ! Surprised it never caught on...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redratbike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2017 at 18:33
Originally posted by Af1 Af1 wrote:


Ideal bike if you only have one leg ! Surprised it never caught on...
right leg so you can keep it warm?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2017 at 09:45
Acquired:
Gen 2 Heads
Gen 2 TB
57 mm intake funnels
Gen 2 down pipes
Edwards airbox lower half
Adapters to the jets
PCIII
TSS slipper clutch
JSPerformance silicone hoses & clips
Valve stem seals, cutch cover gasket, generator cover gasket
1 457,28 €

To be acquired:
Gabro chip
1060 BigBore kit with head & bottom gaskets and pistons
Updated parts list. Still moaning about not having editing rights Cry
Mille Aarrr -02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2017 at 09:50
Disassembly could commence in mid/ late October.
As for the TB I have a question. The "choke" can be set on the Gen2 TB but did that one have the idle adjusting knob on the right hand side of the engine?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Diablo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2017 at 12:47
Yes r/h side. Swap your Gen 1 fast idle mechanism over onto the gen 2 tb's.
Question everything.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redratbike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2017 at 13:08
Originally posted by Diablo Diablo wrote:

Yes r/h side. Swap your Gen 1 fast idle mechanism over onto the gen 2 tb's.
 
about 30 mins work tops to swap the mech. over
 
take a look at some pics in this thread...but once you have the 57's and 51's in front of you it will all become clear
 
 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Sep 2017 at 17:09
Does anyone have pictures of the weld jobs how they have mated the Gen2 downpipes with the Gen1 2-2 Akra?
 
Is there enough length to make the Gen2 downpipe round so that you do not need to modify the Akra system?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Diablo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 2017 at 00:36
I spoke to Griff about this very briefly a while back.

He mentioned about getting some flanges made up and I presumed for this purpose, as I'm wanting to run a Gen 1 Arrow system, on a Gen 2 1060 motor I've got (going in a Gen 1).

I'll be speaking to him hopefully in the next few days, so I'll make a note to ask him about it again buddy.

If not I'll just be cutting some Gen 2 headers and welding those in.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 2017 at 05:13
Cheers.
 
Btw. Have not followed image hosting possibilities since photobucket shafted us. Are there any FOC ones left?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Diablo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 2017 at 15:31
I've been using Flickr since PhotoBucket pulled the plug. But make sure your settings on there are set to private, if you use it, or people can look through all your pics.  PB ruined the whole thread about my bike. It would be easier to start another thread than try to replace everything Ouch

Better and easier still, You don't need an account with image hosters, you can post direct from your pc on here.

If you click on the white arrow, 2nd from the right at the top, when making a post or replying to one, it takes you to the full reply editor -you will see a little green tree on the top row, 4th from the right. Click on that to upload any photo's direct from your pc. You might have to reduce some in size, as I think the maximum size is 2mb Thumbs Up


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 2017 at 22:10
^
Cheers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote j180 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 2017 at 23:44
Postimage is also good for sharing to forums.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Diablo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 13:34
JMH, I've just remembered, you need to be a premium member to post from your pc (I think).

I think it's only about 5 quid. It gives you access to the online manuals as well.

If not, I can only say Flickr, as that's the only one I've used other than Photo*ucket.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2017 at 21:54
Engine dropped to the builder today. Dissasembly will commence 21.10.
I'll be there.
 
By the way, do you know if Griff has slotted cam gears?
 
Secondly, if/ when the Gen2 heads need straightening how much can be afforded?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redratbike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2017 at 22:33
Originally posted by JMH JMH wrote:


Engine dropped to the builder today. Dissasembly will commence 21.10.
I'll be there.
 
By the way, do you know if Griff has slotted cam gears?
 
Secondly, if/ when the Gen2 heads need straightening how much can be afforded?
no he hasn't got the slotted cam wheels.

Sure there is a thread by Micah or amaurai on af1 regarding skimming the heads


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote apriliapista Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 05:44
Af1 sells slotted cam sprockets ,
But it's easy to do yourself!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 16:56
^
I knew that but remembered that the price was higher than what it is. $100 plus postage when I give my old ones in return (well, I have three sets anyway at the moment).
 
Next to this mate of mine doing the engine job with me lives a guy with a shop and he does pretty much what he wants so my mate will ask him about the gears at the same time he asks about straightening the heads.
 
That would be the place to do the exhaust as well as it looks to me it is best to have the engine in place for that job.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote apriliapista Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 23:25
Yes I remember it was a lot of money ( not necessarily expensive?). If you have 3 sets just slot all and sell 2 of them, I'm sure there's members out there who needs a set.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 2017 at 19:02
Information needed on Gen2 correct valve spring length:

The measurement on the used head gives vs. [manual]

Inner: 39 mm vs. [40,9 mm]
Outer: 42 mm vs. [43,4 mm]

Is the spec in the manual correct, the manufacturing done on Monday or what is going on? New springs would set me off ~500 €. Would need 16 of them.

Does aynone have an insight?
Mille Aarrr -02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Oct 2017 at 19:42
It appears the wear limits for the Gen1 valve springs are the same so maybe they would fit, or?
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My riding lines are like Hendrix's solos. Unexpected and always different.
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