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Clutch and that one way valve.

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Stevex View Drop Down
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    Posted: 09 Jan 2019 at 21:49
Removed my throttle bodies to give them a good clean and checked the clutch vac one way valve to find it not working. TBH I'm not even sure it's ever worked since I've owned the bike (2.5 years). I always blip the throttle on down changes and engine braking has always been good with no rear wheel lock ups and I've never had clutch slip.
So...is there any point replacing this valve and would it not just be better to blank off the pipes at the throttle bodies and the clutch cover?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote colinmeadows Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2019 at 21:53
dont blank the pipe off at the clutch cover , i did at first and the clutch lever got worse and worse until i had no clutch lever pressure. i removed the blank and immediately i had my clutch lever pressure back !!
living life in the fairly fast lane rsv mille 2000 & rsv factory 2004, no more until i get a bigger garage ............
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jan 2019 at 22:12
The valve is limited in value if you always blip on downshifts anyway,it's more designed so you don't lock the wheel by just dropping down which is something I can't force myself to do.

I think it also has some effect on clutch pressure as well,or at least helping give the hand an easier time.

Mine was found to be fubared during a service but tbh after spending £20 or whatever for a new one I never noticed any benefit as I always increase the revs during a downshift,I just can't help it,it's ingrained over the years.

Plus when you've learned to get it right you have the possibility of seamless downshifts without the clutch which is very satisfying,especially if your hydraulic slave cylinder decides to blow it's seal as they all do at some time
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blacklines Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2019 at 10:09
Originally posted by IanG IanG wrote:

it's more designed so you don't lock the wheel by just dropping down which is something I can't force myself to do.


Me neither. It's a lot of engine braking at the best of times, dropping without blipping sounds a bit brutal to me.

I had a lot of grief with my back end skidding into turns last time on track and ended up just feathering the clutch out for much longer.

Think it is very dependent on how the air bypass screws are set on the throttle bodies to be honest. With some settings (I think more shut from memory) there's quite heavy engine braking and with others (I think more open) it will freewheel a bit better which makes cornering a bit smoother. Might be worth having a play with because those sigma slippers aren't cheap and the vacuum valve isn't enough I don't think.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote snowman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2019 at 12:41
Me Too, I always blip throttle when changing down , old timer here I’m afraid 😦
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2019 at 12:47
Soon it'll be a thing of the past remembered only by us oldies,electronics will probably be controlling that kind of thing like a big twist & go.

Anyone still able to double de clutch their car? LOL 

An old habit learnt back in the days of synchro-less gearboxes,or in my case sychro-less first gear

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote legend88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2019 at 13:39
Yep I can double de-clutch, did it often when racing.

As you say you soon won't be able to buy a manual car anyway. I was looking at the Audi website the other day and in the A4, only one model, with the most basic engine package can be purchased with a traditional manual box. All the rest come with the complicated and notoriously unreliable S-tronic whether you like it or not!

Everything is being dumbed down for the numpties.
- They can't park without hitting things unless they have sensors.
- They can't stop without hitting things unless they have ABS.
- They can't do hill starts without hitting things unless they have hill-start assist
- They can't go round corners without spinning unless they have traction control
- They can't stay in their own lane without lane assist
- They can't keep their distance from the car in front without automatic braking (Or whatever it is called)
- They can't remember to lock their car unless it has keyless locking
- They find it too difficult to open and close the boot if it takes more than the press of a button

.... and it goes on!

Then with electric vehicles, as you say it will be all twist and go.

Tech is wonderful, as an engineer I find much of it fascinating and electronics has allowed us to do almost everything we can imagine. However, just because we can, doesn't mean we should!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stevex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2019 at 14:58
Originally posted by colinmeadows colinmeadows wrote:

dont blank the pipe off at the clutch cover , i did at first and the clutch lever got worse and worse until i had no clutch lever pressure. i removed the blank and immediately i had my clutch lever pressure back !!

Wonder why this happened. My thinking is that with the clutch cover blanked off there is no vacuum assistance so the clutch will remain fully engaged unless the clutch lever is pulled in. Guess I'll just leave as is then to be on the safe side.
Seems weird that there are 2 lines coming from the bodies but only 1 has the one way valve before the 2 - 1 connector. Does this mean there is always some vacuum assist, but on high vacuum loads created by high rev down shifts you get additional assistance to prevent rear wheel lockup?
That may explain why you lost your clutch Colin.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mixdrive1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2019 at 16:01
I thought all factory fitted semi slipper clutches were just a gimmick by the the manufactures to sell the bikes?
2003R,2003Eddy. Previous RS250,2006Factory,2001mille,2001R,2002mille
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stevex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2019 at 17:37
Just fitted one of these, operates from 2 psi and works with vacuum, well within the Aprilia intake manifold range. Looks very well made and half the price of the plastic oem.

People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IanG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2019 at 18:23
Looks good,let us know how it works?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dog78 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2019 at 21:27
Originally posted by blacklines blacklines wrote:

Originally posted by IanG IanG wrote:

it's more designed so you don't lock the wheel by just dropping down which is something I can't force myself to do.


Me neither. It's a lot of engine braking at the best of times, dropping without blipping sounds a bit brutal to me.

I had a lot of grief with my back end skidding into turns last time on track and ended up just feathering the clutch out for much longer.

Think it is very dependent on how the air bypass screws are set on the throttle bodies to be honest. With some settings (I think more shut from memory) there's quite heavy engine braking and with others (I think more open) it will freewheel a bit better which makes cornering a bit smoother. Might be worth having a play with because those sigma slippers aren't cheap and the vacuum valve isn't enough I don't think.
Slipper clutches aint cheap but for a big twin i think they are worth the expense . I have a yoyodene on mine and on track they are fantastic , you can cog it does in quick succession and just lay down,  if you are a but too aggressive it does back in a little and the first time it can be a bit scary ,but you soon realise that it will always comes back in,  then it is just great fun. To not have to worry about the back locking up give you more time to concentrate also makes corner entry a breeze . It's a great asset and once you have ridden with one you will always long for one.  It's my favorite mod on the bike . They do come up secondhand and worth the money , it transforms the bike on track. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote budd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jan 2019 at 15:22
When I fitted the 57tbs I put 2 one way valves on mine, used these off ebay
seem well made (much better than OE) and a vaiable option to the expensive plastic items, so does having 2 make any difference ? well after using it all last yr I can honestly say it made no discernible difference, (not that I was really expecting any) it was just a little experiment which proved not to work and TBH I think the whole system is of very limited value, a proper slipper clutch is top of my wish list.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dog78 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jan 2019 at 21:34
Originally posted by budd budd wrote:

When I fitted the 57tbs I put 2 one way valves on mine, used these off ebay
seem well made (much better than OE) and a vaiable option to the expensive plastic items, so does having 2 make any difference ? well after using it all last yr I can honestly say it made no discernible difference, (not that I was really expecting any) it was just a little experiment which proved not to work and TBH I think the whole system is of very limited value, a proper slipper clutch is top of my wish list.  
Budd you will love it mate , they don't come up very often .
I got mine from New Zealand. The lad I bought it off said it totally transformed the bike and he was exactly right.
A good place to look for one is on Facebook on the Aprilia groups,  i found one on there for a rsv. Net member for 325 quid with virtually a brand new set of clutch plates
It could easily take a couple of second off a lap.
Good luck mate,  if I see one i will give you a shout. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote damo46 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jan 2019 at 21:37
This is the same one I have used, looks like the gen2 one as well " TOPRAN 112 283 755 CHECK VALVE 058 905 291K 52C3711"








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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blacklines Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 10:21
Originally posted by dog78 dog78 wrote:

Budd you will love it mate , they don't come up very often .
I got mine from New Zealand. The lad I bought it off said it totally transformed the bike and he was exactly right.
A good place to look for one is on Facebook on the Aprilia groups,  i found one on there for a rsv. Net member for 325 quid with virtually a brand new set of clutch plates
It could easily take a couple of second off a lap.
Good luck mate,  if I see one i will give you a shout. 


Couple of seconds a lap?!?

How big is the effect? Does it turn the bouncing into a smoother slide or does it go further and lessen the engine braking a bit too? Does it still work when you're braking hard and there's next to no weight on the back wheel?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dog78 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 11:45
Originally posted by blacklines blacklines wrote:

Originally posted by dog78 dog78 wrote:

Budd you will love it mate , they don't come up very often .
I got mine from New Zealand. The lad I bought it off said it totally transformed the bike and he was exactly right.
A good place to look for one is on Facebook on the Aprilia groups,  i found one on there for a rsv. Net member for 325 quid with virtually a brand new set of clutch plates
It could easily take a couple of second off a lap.
Good luck mate,  if I see one i will give you a shout. 


Couple of seconds a lap?!?

How big is the effect? Does it turn the bouncing into a smoother slide or does it go further and lessen the engine braking a bit too? Does it still work when you're braking hard and there's next to no weight on the back wheel?
Hi blacklines, there's is no bouncing at all, it does lessen the affect of the engine braking. Yes it does slip under hard braking when the back wheel is light. When i was at Donnington last year coming down the back straight , i would leave my braking late and just cog down in quick succession and you don't have to worry about blipping it or when you should change down into the next gear. 
It does feel like it is snaking a little at the back,  but it's fine,  a bit like   moto  2 although the back is snaking around but the back wheel is still rotataing. 
Two incidents i remember when i first took on the the road to text it, the first one was  i came into a bend too hot a hair pin and i had a car on the opposite side so i had to lay over even more and charge into first and it didnt even flinch
It will even slip in first if you shut the throttle off abruttly as it did when a car pulled out in front of me and i was cranked over and the slipper clutch took it easy  than theback move e out. The bike is a lot more composed . If you are anywhere near  hampshire come and have a little go on mine in the spring, another good thing about it is that it protects the engine against over reving.  I came into one corner at Donnington and it a false nutral and in my panic i went down two instead of one,  if it was not for the slipper i reckon i would have been off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote blacklines Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 12:15
Sounds great, will keep an eye out for one going for a good price!

Thanks for the offer dog but Winchester is a bit of a trek from North Yorkshire.

Sorry for interrupting your thread Steve.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stevex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 17:13
No worries, interesting reading. 'Fraid I'm too dyed in the wool with mechanical sympathy to ever do down changes without blipping the throttle though.
Pic of the valve fitted, I had the valve covers blasted clean while I had them off to do the valve shim changes.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aaressveeguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 21:11
no, please no. Don't coax me into adding one more item to the 'wants' list. God, I need to get a grip
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Diablo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 hours 38 minutes ago at 16:59
Originally posted by aaressveeguy aaressveeguy wrote:

no, please no. Don't coax me into adding one more item to the 'wants' list. God, I need to get a grip


We can help you empty your wallet, don't worry about that.

I got hold of a little used Sigma slipper. Not sure if I paid over the odds at nearly 400, but less than a year old.

Sure I saw a very cheap one a few days ago, but didn't pay much attention at the time.
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